Parenting in the Information Age Part 2 continues the conversation by shifting from why this is happening to what parents can actually do about it. In this follow-up episode of Through a Therapist’s Eyes, we focus on the emotional side of parenting in a nonstop digital world – how overwhelmed parents unintentionally pass on anxiety, reactivity, and distraction, and why children learn regulation more from what we model than from the rules we set. We talk directly to parents about slowing information down, checking emotional readiness, and becoming filters rather than firewalls for what kids consume. This episode centers on practical, honest self-reflection and reminds us that the goal isn’t to raise sheltered kids – but emotionally steady ones who can handle information safely because their parents are learning to do the same.
Tune in to see Part 2 of Parenting in the Information Age Through a Therapist’s Eyes.
Think about these three questions as you listen:
- How has the information age changed what it means to be a parent?
- Are children today receiving too much information before they have the emotional structure to process it?
- How do parents regulate themselves emotionally while raising children in a nonstop digital world?
Links referenced during the show:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6567079
https://www.throughatherapistseyes.com/category/podcasts/anxietyanddepression/parenting
https://www.throughatherapistseyes.com/category/podcasts/marriageandfamily
Intro Music by Reid Ferguson – https://reidtferguson.com/
@reidtferguson – https://www.instagram.com/reidtferguson/
https://www.facebook.com/reidtferguson
https://open.spotify.com/artist/3isWD3wykFcLXPUmBzpJxg
Audio Podcast Version Only
Podcast: Play in new window | Download
Episode #341 Transcription
Chris (00:01) All right, hello and welcome to Through a Therapist's Eyes. We are coming at you live on January the 22nd, Thursday. Here at about 6.15 we jump onto the YouTube live if you're catching us for the first time. We do the YouTube live on the Thursday of the week and then it gets populated to all the places you find the podcasts, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, all the different places. So how are we doing this fine evening? We have Miss Casey with us. How are you, dear? Kasie (00:32) Hey, I am doing well just trying to stay warm. For those of you who are listening and don't know, North Carolina, especially in random parts of it, are expecting a winter storm, ice, snow mixture of all this whole weekend. So I'm just trying to gear up and hunker down. Chris (00:50) I mean, you can't be paranoid and terrified like all these southerners, are you, Casey? Kasie (00:55) ⁓ I'm not paranoid about anything other than not having enough toilet paper, but I got some this morning, so I feel prepared. Chris (01:04) we're an international podcast. People down here in the South get all freaked out about a little snow and ice. I think it's absolutely hysterical. I never get tired of making fun of these people being from West Virginia. nevertheless, Mr. John Pope is hanging out with us. How are you, sir? John-Nelson Pope (01:18) I'm doing outstanding and it's 76 degrees down here in Florida. Yeah. And we're not going to get that weather. Chris (01:21) Yeah, I was waiting for that man. I was waiting for that. Look, this is where you get insights from a panel of therapists about mental health and substance abuse, knowing it's not delivery of therapy services in any way. We had an awesome show last week, episode two or three forty. We were talking about parenting in the information age and it was such a. Involved conversation, I don't know, Casey, you were here. We're not going to have Victoria, by the way, or she might be able to pop in. It's undetermined, but. Kasie (01:27) ever. Chris (01:51) I don't know, Casey, our conversation got through about one eighth of the content we tried to do, right? Last week. Kasie (01:56) Yeah, yeah, I don't think it covered, you know, just about, it just scratched the surface, I would say. Chris (02:03) You know, there's so much when we're looking at the information age and I'm still ever presently shocked, John, at how much there is in the way that affects our life. But I got the book out through a therapist's eyes, Re-understanding Emotions of Becoming Your Best Self. Somebody actually caught that somewhere in Great Britain. And I'm having a dialogue. I'm just beginning dialogue, but we're going to have an awesome guest that is an amazing topic. And he happened to catch that book. So. ⁓ You know who you are, can't make it public yet. We haven't really talked yet, but I have some cool ideas with this guy that we may track and we'll see what develops. But stay tuned because we're always trying to get fun new things. Subscribe, click, do your job. Okay, please help us. We do our job by creating this content free for you and your job is to help us to get found more. we do have a new YouTube subscriber, Mr. Nick Chamberlain, who has joined us. And ⁓ I have just made an acquaintance with Mr. Chamberlain and so stay tuned as well. There might be some new things as well with Nick. So I'm kind of excited about that. Sorry to be cryptic, but we'll see what happens and develops again. Stay tuned. ⁓ Regal. We like regality. John-Nelson Pope (03:12) Well that is a very regal name, Chamberlain. That's regal, yeah, it's a very noble, noble name. Chris (03:21) John, how many stars they gotta give us? John-Nelson Pope (03:23) Oh, they've got to give us five stars, five stars all the way. And it helps us rise to the top and so that we get seen and it makes those algorithms magic happen for us. So it's very important. I mean, you got to like it. I mean, you got to like it, right? That's right. Right. Chris (03:39) It's very important. Click the subscribe, click the little bell. Well, that's true. You can't lie, right? You can't lie. Contact it through atherapistize.com is a great way to interact with us. We've gotten some comments on YouTube. We're a little bit backed up with that. We need to get onto it. Neil's gonna coach me up on finding them, because I didn't see them. So I apologize in not having found them. And then through atherapistize.com is actually where you can get old podcasts that are really still highly valid. I refer clients to our shows all the time because it speaks to a lot of content that we develop and what we do in our therapy offices. Also, I'll tell you what, Casey, I apologize. You've been here back for a month and I have not done the job of telling them how people can find you to do therapy. So we're all at Metrolina Psychotherapy Associates, which by the way, I haven't done a good job either. If you're in North Carolina and you want therapy, you can contact us. We're active therapists. We do it all day long. We're at 704. Five? No, that was almost my cell phone number. That would be bad. Kasie (04:39) Yeah. John-Nelson Pope (04:44) No. Chris (04:48) That would be bad. Don't call that one. Call Metrolinus Psychotherapy Associates at 704-461-8253. Casey, how do people find you, Kasie (04:59) So there are a couple different ways. The first way is to give me a call at 980-858-5413 or if you just go to kcksiemorgancounseling.com, it will take you to my website and you can look and explore to see if it looks like I would be a good therapeutic fit for you. And I am right now virtual only, but in the future we'll see what happens. Chris (05:27) Yeah, we need to see what happens. I'mma prod you along. John, she's the best of all of us, wouldn't you say? I mean, let's be honest. We gotta be honest. We're genuine on this show. So yeah, look us up. Now listen, we believe that mental health and substance abuse is primarily important in our lives. And so ⁓ it's becoming even more more important as we go along in this world. And we've identified it more and so. John-Nelson Pope (05:33) I would say so absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Kasie (05:35) Well, close. John-Nelson Pope (05:40) That's all. Kasie (05:41) Thank you. Chris (05:54) We believe this is important and this content here for all of us. So our endeavor is to figure this thing out together. The human emotional experience. Set it backwards, but it got to be fresh, right? Kasie (06:07) That's right. Chris (06:08) They're like, yeah, Chris, you just covered up and screw up, but that's okay. Shall we get into the show? Shall we get into the stuff? The questions that we had last week, we're still on board. How has the information age changed and what does it mean to be a parent? Secondly, are children today receiving too much information before ⁓ they have the ability to attain and manage and, you know, have this emotional structure to process it? The answer to that honestly is Casey. Kasie (06:38) Yes. Chris (06:39) Yeah. Thirdly, how do parents regulate themselves emotionally while raising children in a nonstop digital world? And I think that that's something that we're definitely going to cover today because listen, parents out there, you know, we we like to protect kids, right? We we like to make sure kids can function and and manage all of this information, you know, coming at them. And ⁓ one of the big segments here today needs to be for sure. What about us? You know, are we really regulated with all this? Because as I have said, this is humanity's greatest challenge, the rapid change of progression in technology. And I don't think we're handling it well, but more on that in a little bit. So did we cover all the front end stuff? Where did we leave off? We left off, I think, just getting through a little bit of section two. My thing here is not. Somebody save me. Where did we leave off? Because I'm on a. ⁓ Kasie (07:18) Mm-hmm. John-Nelson Pope (07:38) The emotional constant. Kasie (07:38) Yeah, it's... John-Nelson Pope (07:40) I'm sorry. No, no, Casey, yeah. Kasie (07:40) Go ahead. Chris (07:41) What's that? Casey, where did we leave off? Kasie (07:44) Yeah, really we had just kind of bridged from segment one to segment two and we were talking about and kind of left it with the questions last time that we got to and I think you were starting on the isolating parts of technology. And yeah, so I think we really are just bridging from segment one to segment two. Chris (08:09) And the big thing here that we were trying to get at is this line that I think is a poignant line really. And it says kids know things they can't feel safely. Right? mean, we're getting exposed ourselves to all sorts of things that we almost don't make choices about. And that's by clicking and scrolling and moving and posting and engaging and even telephones now, you know, John-Nelson Pope (08:21) Mmm. Kasie (08:23) Yeah. Chris (08:39) you get inundated with texts and people that are ⁓ reaching out to you, elderly folks with fraud and romance and dating apps. It goes on and on with all of the things that we're getting exposed to. And I tell you what, kids actually are as well. And so they know a lot more because they've been exposed to a lot more at their age, whatever age it is than we ever thought about being. John, you and I, for sure, right? I mean, John-Nelson Pope (09:07) Right. Chris (09:09) You know, Casey, you as well, you know, Victoria being younger, you know, she really experienced a lot of that in the last 20 years. It's just exploded. But they're not able to feel safety with all of those things that they don't even know they're being exposed to. We won't even talk about porn and all the different dramatic things with sex trafficking and things that people are getting caught up in, in, in, foster homes and, there's just a lot. So they know a lot. they can't be safe with it. And our goal is to help us be safe and facilitating ourselves and then helping the kids kind of grow their resiliency and their ability to unfortunately deal with adult content. Is that even possible? But that's kind of our goal, right? Kasie (09:57) Yeah, I think what we often equivocate safety with is control. And so that's where it can get blurry, right? Like sometimes we think of it as if we can control the content, if we can control like the usage, if we can control all the elements around usage, then we're cutting it off at the pass. And what we're neglecting is to see the differences between. controlling what we might talk about in a little bit, which is the behavior of it versus the emotional outpouring of it. And I think that that is the key difference in some of the things that I know that I see even in my own parenting experience with an 18 year old, a 14 year old and a 12 year old that access the internet regularly on their phones. And then my 10 year old who thinks she has some type of access. Chris (10:47) And what kind of access does she actually have? Trick question. John-Nelson Pope (10:48) Hmph. Kasie (10:51) Like, she can just like, I don't know, like there's like a, like kids messenger, like we have approved things with other parents and then she can message her friends on that. That's about it. but, but yeah. Chris (11:06) I'm gonna be bold in this moment. I promised last time I'm gonna be bold about something. Hopefully that comes up in a little bit because I think there's a big statement that I wanna make. But this is one of those as well too. We're starting to wrangle with policies and school procedures and... what we make available and whatnot. And I'll tell you what, feel like smartphones are gonna start to be needed to be treated like alcohol and cannabis and whatnot. Like ⁓ Casey, you just alluded to your kid just having very tamped down access to texting and posting and all that kind of stuff. I don't know, I'm really starting to get into a landing spot where I don't think people under the age of 18 need to have smartphones. Like at all. John-Nelson Pope (12:03) So you're thinking in terms of being Australian, like the, right, in Australia they've, well, the whole country, by law, I guess through their, ⁓ their, their Senate or whatever, their former government, they have states and they have senators. Chris (12:09) Right? Do you know much about that? Speak about that because that's a whole country that has decided this. John-Nelson Pope (12:28) but in Australia, it's the representatives. They basically have a law now that it's limited to a certain age. I think it might be 16. I may be wrong on that. Maybe Neil can check that as well. But the idea is that no one's on social media until a certain age. And... You know, a democracy or a representative government can actually do that without being totalitarian. It's basically giving some agency to the parents and to the schools so that they have the control of the social media, ⁓ over social media, what is given to their kids. Chris (13:26) You know what, let's park out here for a second, because I just thought of this in my brain as a counterbalance argument to what I just laid out and what John Australia just explained is doing. I do have, what did you say? Go blame me, go blame me young man. So yeah, 16, 18, no smartphones. Okay, that's one thing. John-Nelson Pope (13:39) Cold blind me. Cold blind me. Chris (13:55) But then I am kind of noticing the younger generations that are kind of coming on to their 20s, like my kids are 24 and 21 right now, right? And they grew up, they're the first cohort in all of humanity that has had their entire life in this space with rapid technology development. And what I think I've noticed in kind of real time in a societal John-Nelson Pope (14:19) Mm-hmm. Chris (14:25) macro level thinking that you know they do all the snapchats they get the streaks they take a picture of the shoe and send it to their friend crazy weird behavior silly stuff dating online you know you got kids dating ⁓ girl boys dating girls in in nevada when they're in you know south carolina and boston and you know and there's all these different things that kids are doing and they kind of get to their 20s 18 they graduate high school and they're kind of like wait a minute that stuff's kid stuff i don't want to do the kids stuff anymore. Also Facebook is for old people. So they kind of really put this stuff down. I guess I'm wondering if that is an observation that is correct. Do we hamper that if we limit that? John-Nelson Pope (15:01) Hahaha! Chris (15:12) You know? Kasie (15:12) I mean, I don't think it's hampering. think it's, you know, I think it is almost, you know, earlier in the show you talked about it being like alcohol and things like that. It's almost like the argument of if we don't, like, you know, when parents come into our office and they say, well, I'll let them drink if they drink at my house and things like that, right? Like, it kind of equivocates to me in that kind of sense where it's like, Chris (15:32) Yeah, right. Kasie (15:37) ⁓ well, as long as they're doing it in front, I would rather them do it in front of me and be honest about it than behind my back or something like that. ⁓ I don't know if you know, but we actually do have some regulation in the United States and certain states have their own regulatory laws surrounding social media, even in the USA. Chris (15:59) Right. Well... John-Nelson Pope (16:00) I was just thinking that there has always been a problem to a certain extent about ⁓ having them drink at our house. That was part of my generation. I'm a boomer, you know? And we had ⁓ parents that would say, okay, you can drink as long as you do it at our house and you can have parties. Kasie (16:10) Yeah. Chris (16:22) John's like, actually our group like did a bunch of Quaaludes and stuff. Quaaludes. ⁓ Kasie (16:26) Yeah! John-Nelson Pope (16:26) That's That's right. Quaaludes. Yeah, I brought that up with one of my clients the other day. it was the, because it was the drug of choice. The Quaaludes were my generation. So. Chris (16:44) It's just, know, Casey, you say there are some rules and I don't, I'm not worldly traveled enough to know what y'all do around the world internationally, but I think let's move on with our conversation today with the recognition that there is such a rapid pace that we can't keep up with any kind of research studies or thoughtfulness or debate or understanding because it's happening so fast. And I think Casey, you were talking about that to where, you know, research, mean, how do you have a longitudinal study on the effect of parenting in the information age when it's only been 15 years? You know? Kasie (17:25) Yeah, well, and it's hard to because correlation is not causation, right? And we know that from other research stuff. So it's hard to say. this happened to this cohort of kids and with this parenting style and what that looks like when there's not, there might be correlation between events, but there's not necessarily causation, right? Kind of like violence in video games and violence in real life. Like there's a lot of correlation between events, but there isn't a lot of information or studies for causation in that. John-Nelson Pope (17:54) Does it cause it? Yeah. Kasie (17:57) And so I think that's what is going to make this hard is because there is correlation between things that we see, but it doesn't necessarily dictate ⁓ causation. And what I think is funny, even going back to Australia and places like that about the age of accountability, what we do know in neurology and what we do know in science of the brain is that the frontal lobe is not fully closed until you are 25 years old, right about that time. John-Nelson Pope (18:26) It's even, they're even pushing it to 30 now. Yeah, so it's a Kasie (18:29) Right, yeah, and so, yeah, so making an age like 16, 18, 20, I mean, it's still not really addressing when we're at our best selves, our best thinking selves. Chris (18:41) Yeah, and I'm glad you brought that up because I was gonna do that as well because you brought that up last time. We do know a lot about neurology. Now, I think we don't know near as much we're gonna know, but we've begun to scratch into that domain of understanding neurology and developmental neurology is even more probably dynamic as the brain stuff is changing just with puberty and what. John-Nelson Pope (19:04) thinking in terms of as former military myself and your your son being in that is being quite adam quite young going into it but that may be it's not such a bad thing in a sense of having Chris (19:11) Shout out to Adam, awesome. John-Nelson Pope (19:22) The reality is that our brains still are developing or haven't developed. And so there might have to be some sort of structure and strictures ⁓ on ⁓ constraints on people. Even the Romans said that you weren't a mature adult until you were ⁓ after 25. Chris (19:42) Yeah, and here's the thing to get back to the emotional costs of too much information. That was our segment two. When you don't understand something or you don't have the neurological ability and brain development well into your 20s, possibly up to 30s. Actually, that's the first I've heard that guys curious about what you mean by that. Not today, but please teach me sometime soon. The idea is what happens when you don't understand something? Well, you get fearful. You get you get overwhelmed. John-Nelson Pope (20:01) Mm-hmm. Chris (20:10) your emotions dysregulate because you don't, you can't wrap your arms around something. And so that just puts into this chronic perpetual state of elevated emotion. John-Nelson Pope (20:23) Well, I'm just thinking in terms of that, that maybe we're, there's so much anxiety that's generated with all the new technologies and all of that, that people are getting wired to be overly anxious and overly worried and where people were, let's say, it took several years for people to stop wearing masks after the COVID. And I saw that with a... Chris (20:51) I still see people. John-Nelson Pope (20:53) a lot of young people that do this and they feel like they can't trust anything or that the world is not a safe place and in many ways it isn't but in other ways we've over stated how dangerous the world is. Chris (20:56) Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dated. I think so, you know, and you have to kind of figure out how to handle that. You know, the, you know, we moved to resiliency, Casey, you're kind of sweet spot, but you know, if you just, if you just think about how this regulating it is to be overrun with stuff. And I feel like, you know, we are, you know, in a constant chronic state of anxiety and that creates the loneliness, ⁓ epidemic that we've talked about. And I mean, just before the show, Neil was kind of getting on, trying to help me find the YouTube comments and things and there's a different way to go into it now. He's telling me, I'm like, wait a minute. I was like, okay, you're right, Neil, we're gonna do this later because I gotta do the show and I can't absorb what it is you're telling me. Actually, he picked up on it and told me like, all right, stop Chris, we'll do this later. Because he saw like, I'm struggling. It's like I was anxious before we got on the show in a way. I'm gonna just chill with it, okay, but it's just that little edge of stress, that little edge of. not knowing that little constant chronic next thing, more information. It's just, what does that do to a psychology system? Kasie (22:23) Yeah, it can really overload it in a moment. And I even think back to... like the concept of access, which is what we talked about a lot last time, is about the sheer amount of access, right? And it's not just access to information, but access to the person. And I think that's something that we do need to address on the show, which is, you know, used to be, like when I was in school and stuff, if I needed to tell somebody something, I couldn't text them, obviously, because that wasn't a thing. I would have to write a note, take it to their locker, put it in the slit in their locker, and hope that they get it the next day, or slip it in a textbook or something like that. And then because of long distance calling and charging a fee every time you make a phone call and my parents regulating the amount of like times I could call somebody, I may not have have the ability to talk to that person, you know, for a couple days to see if they even got the information that I gave them. Right. Well, now I can be a keyboard warrior whenever I want to be. Send whatever I want in whatever platform I want. I can make it anonymous. if I want to. I can stand ten toes down on principle and make it my face be shown about it. Or I can create a whole different persona and put myself out there in a different way. And so direct access to people is the other part of this that I think is so anxiety provoking in a lot of ways because once something is out there, it is free reign for people to comment, look at, destroy, talk forever. Chris (23:56) forever. John-Nelson Pope (23:58) Yeah, I was just thinking that that 50 years ago, 55 years ago, I was playing chess via mail. And I think I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago. But I mean, and it took me forever to to play a game of chess. was wonderful because you you you contemplated your moves, you got it all planned out. You started thinking ahead and all of that. And now we had just Kasie (24:13) Yeah. Chris (24:13) And it was fantastic. John, you and I are finding some apps soon. You and I are gonna be starting to play chess, brother. You don't know what you just did to me. John-Nelson Pope (24:30) Yeah, my god, yeah Kasie (24:33) Play it by mail! No, play it by mail! Chris (24:36) I don't know about mail, we might need to upgrade it a little bit, but you know, absolutely. Alright, we gotta move on though. So let me tie something together and move into segment three here. We don't have time today, we're not going to be talking about Love and Logic, but I don't even want, I failed last time of getting all the way through the show without mentioning Love and Logic. It is my go-to strategy, it is my go-to idea. Episode 15 was the first time that we covered it, Craig and I did eons ago. John-Nelson Pope (24:37) Yeah, we could do that. Chris (25:05) and you'd have to go to throughtherapistize.com to find that particular episode, but you get into the initial love and logic introduction there, and then episode 273, we did a review, and then in 299, we had our whole panel and did a review as well. So we've redone that content a few times because it's so primary to being able to do parenting. And there's a fundamental switch that they identified. And that fundamental switch is something really important here that we're touching on how to interact with your child in this age specifically, because their switch is like not just discipline. Like we all think parenting is synonymous with privilege loss and disciplining our child and spare the rod with spanking and different philosophies that go into that. And discipline is important. Teaching life lessons is what the goal is. And discipline is a part of that. But if you think about your relationship with your child, that's what they highlight. Like, build a relationship with your child so that you can teach them. And the big switch here is that parents are often told to monitor screen time, control what you can control, limit setting and all of that. And that is good. I'm not downing that. But I want to focus and hone in on how do you teach. John-Nelson Pope (26:26) They don't teach people, they don't teach their children regulation because if you do it all... I'm sorry, sorry. No, Well, the thing is is that you need to teach them how to monitor themselves and have that self-discipline. And so it's, it is step by step. That also means intentionality. Chris (26:31) Exactly. You stole my thunder. Run with it, John. Absolutely. No, no, no. Get into it, jaunt. Run, John. John-Nelson Pope (26:53) and that you just don't give them a tablet when you go through ⁓ to a big box store and so you go shopping and so they just play on the video or the tablet screen. You teach them times that they you can you actually are involved with the times that they're on screen. You don't you at the same time don't tell them how to ⁓ All the things they need to know you allow them to maybe even make some mistakes ⁓ So, I don't know just Chris (27:32) First of all, we have music that's very sound lovely. What is that? That you? Kasie (27:35) Yeah. John-Nelson Pope (27:35) ⁓ sorry, that's my ⁓ daughter. Yeah, she wasn't supposed to call. Yeah. Yeah. So I tried to turn it off, but ⁓ anyway. Kasie (27:39) I thought it was like, we have a new theme song! Chris (27:41) Yes, baby! That was like background perfect synchronized ⁓ component there. Kasie (27:46) It was. Chris (27:50) John, the thing is teaching emotional digestion. Yes, how they're going to get the information and how do we teach them to handle the information. But here's the thing. Decision making, processing, understanding, conceptualizing. But here's the thing. What do we need if we're going to teach our students? John-Nelson Pope (27:53) Yeah. Decision making. Yeah. Ethical challenges. ⁓ Kasie (28:11) We have to check ourselves before we wreck ourselves. Chris (28:14) Simply put, what does that mean, Casey? Kasie (28:17) Yeah, so as John was talking, I was sitting there thinking like, ⁓ one, you're absolutely correct, but two, how often are we dysregulated ourselves and how often do we use distraction and things like that when we're dysregulated by accessing technology or even just battling everyday ⁓ objectives? And so if we, as the parent, are unable to ascertain the skills necessary to regulate, then it's really difficult to then teach our children how to do that. Now, also, it's about progress and not perfection, which I think is great to teach your child as well. But, you know, we've got to move away from the concept of do as I say, not as I do. We actually have to do and do. We've got to move away from that concept. reason is is because our kids ⁓ one can see right through that logic they can see right through the logic And they see right through that screen. And the reason why they see right through it is because they are keen observers of your life, whether you realize it or not, whether they have a tablet or something in front of their face or not. They are keen observers of your life. And so when they see you unable to effectively manage stress and big emotions and things that come up in life, and they see you check out and they see you use distraction. techniques that are not always healthy or they see you having to do something to co-regulate with yourself because using your own skills is not sufficient, then they understand it that way. So when you go and talk to them about, you want to sit down and talk to them about, you know, regulating their emotions and regulating their feelings and what to do when they have big feelings, but they hear you and like maybe your partner screaming at each other, it's not making sense. John-Nelson Pope (30:19) I got a question for you. This is as therapist and ⁓ maybe other therapists that may be listening online or seeing this on YouTube is that I'm actually working with ⁓ a younger client, ⁓ a younger adult. and had never learned that it's wrong to do the consequences of being able... He said, I could never do well in school unless I cheated and I don't know how not to cheat. And how do I, as an old fogey that I am, would be able to help guide him and help him understand that because it's ethics. It's ⁓ also, I'm kind of wondering about the parents. You know, why has that not been inculcated in the child and yet without sounding judgmental because I'm a counselor and I have to put that on this, my Presbyterian minister, ⁓ cloak off and be a counselor. Chris (31:45) Yeah, I want to jump on this, John, because I get it's a wonderful question, a wonderful thought. And I think you as a grandparent figure in therapy, right? We take on different transference roles. Sometimes it's a brother, sometimes it's a father, sometimes it's a grandfather, or in your case, AC. Yeah, the account transfer is stupid. But what I'm getting at is, is when we take on those transference roles and whatnot, like, I think that we can join John-Nelson Pope (31:58) Yeah, it is counter-transference on my part. Yeah. Chris (32:13) with what somebody's struggling with. And I was really feeling what you're saying because my son struggled with dyslexia and ADHD. He just couldn't get the ABCs and one, two, threes. And I have the marks in my dining room table still to this day right over there that will prove it. And so it's really joining with that struggle and then creating hope with your child or your grandchild or your client in our case, to... John-Nelson Pope (32:38) Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Chris (32:42) to find a way to battle that. And I would use the example and have with my son a special forces operator that I worked with that had dyslexia also and learned and read and fought and pushed to develop those skills because he had a deficit, right? John-Nelson Pope (33:00) But it's easier now to just to do the easy way out and use AI and that sort of thing. Whereas 40 years ago, yeah, you're dyslexic and Nelson Rockefeller, was ⁓ governor of New York, but also vice president during the time of Gerald Ford, he was Chris (33:06) Yeah. Yeah. John-Nelson Pope (33:26) severely dyslexic. I mean it was and he had to have special tutoring throughout his ⁓ education. Brilliant man. But we don't, he didn't have those advantages and so ⁓ but my client has access to tools that would help him not learn it and internalize it. Chris (33:51) Yeah, it's a double-edged sword because there's also technology that can help, you know? mean, hold your hand if you don't rely on it too much. ⁓ Gosh, it's just such a conundrum. John-Nelson Pope (33:58) and Yeah, it is. Chris (34:05) Yeah. Okay, let's let's move on with the parents are just related to I promised a bold statement. Here it comes. You ready, Casey? Kasie (34:13) I'm John-Nelson Pope (34:13) Okay, I'm ready too. Chris (34:16) She's She's jumping. I have had this thought for a while and I have not really revealed it. ⁓ Even to family or friends or, you know, much of anybody, certainly not on the platform and not in my therapy office either. This is like a first for me, but darn it, you know, I'm going to make a statement because I felt that it was it's been this way for a while and it's just proliferated to where it's just absolutely almost more normalized. rather expected that you use these technology things, Neil or John, like you had just said. You use them because they're available and what effect does it have? The specific thing that I'm talking about right now is the dots on your phone. Parents want to protect their kids and they put their kid on their phone as a dot and follow them everywhere they go. They track their speed on their driving. They track their locations. They track what they're doing, when they're doing it. You know, I think it's going to get to a point where you can turn on a microphone and listen in. That might sound crazy to you, but I don't think we're that far away from that. And I'm going to make the bold statement that I think we need to stop that. Horde. Full. Stop. I don't think that we need to follow our kids in that way, trying to protect them when we can't. And it does nothing but create anxiety for our parenting. So that we're sitting there checking and checking and checking and checking. The entire prom night, a parent probably looks at their phone and their dot more than 50 times over that four or five hours. And I don't think that's good. I know I'm going to get creamed. mean, I welcome you to come to contact it through a therapist eyes dot com email me let's get a dialogue going right that's my drop John John-Nelson Pope (36:13) No, didn't... Be careful. Okay, well, you know, I okay, and I would agree and I would say that that is wonderful. I got to tell you the first time I went to a fraternity party ⁓ in my first year in college. I'm wholeheartedly agreeing and and so I came back. I'm sorry, but I'm an old fogey. Okay, so I've used that term before but ⁓ Chris (36:33) Wait a minute, are you wholeheartedly agreeing? Wow. Okay. John-Nelson Pope (36:47) I got so wasted and I threw up and I put a Gideon Bible on my chest and I said never never again and I came home ⁓ and went to the house ⁓ and ⁓ I smelled and reeked of alcohol is just ⁓ awful terrible. I was underage. Okay. And at the same time my mom Chris (36:58) man. John-Nelson Pope (37:16) and dad didn't say a thing to me because they knew I suffered enough. And they did not accept it. And yet at the same time, they accepted me and they loved me. And that was, and I never had a problem after that. And so they, they didn't have a, didn't, they gave me enough rope that I went too far and I regretted it. And then I came back. Chris (37:32) Wow. Right. John-Nelson Pope (37:44) And so I stayed within that constraint and those parameters. We need to be able to develop that. We need to be able to trust our kids and have that at least on some level and then also to let go of our anxiety. Chris (38:01) as parents. John-Nelson Pope (38:03) as parents, yeah. Because we're gonna screw up no matter what we do. And yet at the same time, there's grace in the fact that we can learn from those mistakes. How else are the kids gonna learn regulation? and to regulate themselves. And that's so that calls on parents and behooves parents to have some self-regulation. Chris (38:29) Well, John, I must say I'm a little bit surprised and I'm actually relieved because honestly, I feel like I just went out on a freaking huge limb. Go ahead, crush me, Casey. Kasie (38:37) Yeah, so I wouldn't say that I completely disagree. I definitely don't wholeheartedly agree, right? I think it's a lofty assumption to say that having dots on the phone or Life360, which is what my family utilizes, that it is an effort of, you know, trying to, you know, know where everybody is all the time and things like that, and that it's completely anxiety based. Now, please hear me. I do know people that watch Life 360 or Dots like it's Netflix. I do know people like that. That literally, if it had a monthly subscription, they pay a monthly subscription and they will get the premium package. I do know people like that, for sure. And I would say that it evokes in some people that sense of fear or a false sense of security. John-Nelson Pope (39:12) Yeah. Kasie (39:28) I also want to make the statement that things are going to happen whether they're on your dots or your Live 360 or not. You know, things are still going to happen, right? I think the difference for me, and maybe it is my age, and maybe it is things that we've had exposure to, and maybe it is things that are publicized now that, you know, the content that we see. But... There is so much more now going on with things like sexual exploitation, trafficking, things like that, that sometimes I think it is beneficial that at least if you know where a device is in the vicinity of where a person is located, it is beneficial when it comes to, you know. ultimate realm, like macro level types of safety things. I don't think it's going to prevent bad things from happening. I don't think it's going, I think it can drum up anxiety. I don't think it's going to prevent, you know, like car crashes or anything like that, because that's still going to happen. But the fact is, is that in those moments of clarity and peace of mind in this day and age, when there are so many people who have access your children whether you like it, not, or control it, I think this is an added layer of protection in some way. John-Nelson Pope (40:54) Just one thing and that's Chris (40:54) Well, hold on, on, John, hold on, John. Neil popped on the screen and that tells me that Neil's got words for me. Neil (41:02) So I have two things about this. One, I agree with you, Chris, ⁓ with I don't think you need it. ⁓ But here's a question I have for you, because someone in my family, ⁓ they have it on their phone and their kids' phones. How do you feel about the kids having access to the parents knowing where the parents are at all time? to even it out, right? I don't agree with that. think that as a parent, there's a difference in that versus the children having that same access. So that's one question. Like, you know, do you think as a parent, you have to open up that door so your kids can see everything you're doing? Kind of weird. The other part that I had happen with my oldest kid is he would, yeah, go ahead. Chris (41:41) Can we address that real quick though before I forget it? Because it's a really interesting thing. And I guess I'd like John and Casey to chime in on that too, Neil, because, you know, yeah, there's a different power structure between a parent who is in ⁓ an authority position. And to reverse that is definitely a little bit weird, but it has the same type of thing. Like we have separation anxiety as a diagnosis. Now it would seem that it would help a child to see where their mom or dad is to calm them, but it doesn't calm them. We know with separation anxiety, five minutes after the parent leaves, they regulate, they settle down. So it's not helpful in my, in my John-Nelson Pope (42:27) Do you think that maybe, how old are you thinking in terms of separation anxiety for kids, Chris? Okay, yeah. Yeah, I'm just, but I'm just also thinking that part of this and part of becoming an adult and growing into adulthood in terms of with all the rights and responsibilities, we think about the rights, but we don't think about the responsibilities as much. Chris (42:33) I mean it could be into young adulthood, but yeah. John-Nelson Pope (42:56) ⁓ is that they have to learn how to maybe make it on for the first time that they're not, ⁓ they're staying overnight or they're, ⁓ that they need to know that they can call on their parents and be able to contact them, but that the parents aren't going to let them, can't come and get them all the time. ⁓ Chris (43:23) Okay, so we gotta be a little short here. I'm aware of time. We're fine with time. But I know we could talk about this for the next hour, okay? Casey, comment and then we'll go to Neil for your second part. John-Nelson Pope (43:30) Yeah. Kasie (43:34) Yeah, I think in this territory, I think we're bordering on some hypocrisy. And this is why I say that. Like in one sense, we're saying in the sense of Life360, if you're going to have it, then don't model it. But I don't agree with that. think that first and foremost, as an adult, I can venture to any place that I want to venture to as an adult. You know, I'm making adult decisions. If my children see me going somewhere, you know, like, so be it. You know, I don't think it's a have to situation where they have to know where I'm at all the time. But I definitely think that I want to model that I will be where I say I'm going to be, you know, and if I say I'm going to be at home, I'm going to be at home. John-Nelson Pope (44:09) Mm-hmm. Exactly. Exactly. You're not going to be at the strip club. Kasie (44:21) Right. And if I am, I am a, how old am I? 43 year old adult that is enjoying some entertainment, you know? And at that point, we can have a responsibility conversation. if, and it doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing, but I think if I'm gonna go in, I'm going all in. If I'm gonna allow access to my children to be able to utilize technology for their personal use, I am modeling what that looks like at every facet and aspect of the uses of technology. Chris (44:57) Dynamic in it. We're have to be short guys. Neal's got another one Neil (45:01) So last thing with Life360, this is fun. A kid was driving around a bunch of his brother's friends at one point, and at some point Life360 registered him going 91 down Highway 74 in Gastonia. One of the kid's moms freaked out. Here's the thing, two other kids had Life360. They came back and said he never went above 55. But because this one time Life360 registered the speed wrong, The parent took that as gospel. I mean, how much strain has this caused on parents because they're relying on technology that is not trustworthy? John-Nelson Pope (45:36) But there's also not having a central trust in your kiddo. Neil (45:42) Yeah, but it's still, if you're putting trust in a technology that's not, I mean, like I said, with a lot of the stuff you look at, it becomes that gospel that these parents are looking at. just, it gets very frustrating when you look at those. And as someone who works in technology all the time, I've seen technology screw up more than I've seen it work. So I just, I think there's a lot of stuff when it comes down to it that it goes back to John, said, trust your kids, trust what's going on, be aware of it. Chris (45:59) Wow, yeah. Neil (46:06) I'll use Find My Phone Every Once In While with my youngest kid, because I don't know where he's going. I'll just do a quick ping to see where he is if I need to. I've done it like three times, like total. I don't need to know exactly where he is. Chris (46:16) And that's the way I use it with my 24 year old right now, Neil. But you know, it's an interesting thing too because the dot says you're here, but you're actually like across the street in a completely different store, you know. Right. Neil (46:26) ⁓ Deer and Helene? It freaked out my kid's friend's mom because they said he was in Asheville at some point, Deer and Helene, because he pinged and that's where the tower was. that caused so much anxiety for the mom because she didn't know where her son was for like three days or something, thinking he's more knows where. So you just have to be careful with, you know, how you as a... Yeah. Use the tools wisely and figure out how it works with your system and, you know, go from there. John-Nelson Pope (46:46) Technology, Yeah. ⁓ Chris (46:48) It backfires. It backfires. Okay, we need to move on. I know we want to stay here, but we need to move on. I want to move us to again, parents as emotional containment, not control mechanisms. So think about this line. Children don't learn regulation from rules. They learn regulation from regulated adults. And Casey, I think that's what you were really hitting on. They are not going to learn from a bedtime. John-Nelson Pope (46:54) Trust the Force Luke. Chris (47:24) They are going to learn from the deep conversations that you have about life decisions and responsibilities and the methods of decision making that consider time the next day. They need to learn from us, not from rules. John-Nelson Pope (47:39) As Uncle Ben said in Spider-Man, he says, with great power comes great responsibility. ⁓ Kasie (47:44) Great responsibility. Chris (47:45) Love it. Love it. Yeah, you know, I mean, I think that's such a switch. That's why I mentioned love and logic, because we're trying to switch parenting mindset from just disciplining, just creating limits, just creating consequences, and instead focus on your relationship. Focus on, John, you talked about trust. That's beautiful. know, building rapport. and the ability to talk about sex, talk about drugs, to talk about violence, to talk about fighting, to talk about school, to talk about career choices, to talk about religion, to talk about God or, you know, Yahweh or Buddhist traditions. mean, we need to get that relationship built. And I wonder if information technology is pulling us apart from that very thing that kids need to learn from. the relationship and our own regulation. Sound crazy? I mean, I think that's our task. John-Nelson Pope (48:55) No, think it's Kasie (48:57) Was there a question in there? Sorry. Chris (49:01) What'd say, Casey? Kasie (49:02) Was there a question in there? ⁓ Chris (49:04) No, there's a statement, It's just it's a statement. And, know, the job of parenting is is is not to block information, it's to slow it down, to contextualize it, to emotionally translate it, to understand it with. I mean, look, I love this this show in this platform, the human emotional experience, which we endeavor to figure out together. I don't just create those words at the beginning of show for nothing. You know. How much are we figuring this thing out? know, my kid's going to get into dating and I'm afraid he's not going to talk to me about it at all. And I really hope that he does. Right. Have I built that relationship that he can come to me and talk? No, think I have. And he's told me probably a little bit stuff I don't want to hear. Love you, Aaron. But, you know, but that's okay. Right. How do we manage that? You know, can we can we change our mindset in what our job is as a parent? John-Nelson Pope (49:41) Yeah. Yeah. Chris (50:03) there i did it again casey a stop there's no to me monster of questions just ⁓ Kasie (50:08) Yeah, you just said, can we change our mindset? And what I do think is that where we want to start from is really focusing on ourselves. Like focus on yourself first, right? I'm a parent. I'm focusing on myself. What are the aspects of my own regulation process that could use some tweaking? Right? Like when I start from that place and I think about what it is that I even do to get myself regulated, if I don't have adequate responses to that question, then I do need to start there. Because I am going to be trying to implement something with my children in our relationship that I don't even do myself. John-Nelson Pope (50:27) you Kasie (50:56) And so you want it to be authentic, right? You want to have authenticity around things that can be helpful. If I think them talking to me is helpful, who are the other adults that I talk to that are helpful? You know, if I think on being able to have a reflective practice like journaling is helpful, do I journal? You know, am I doing something that is assistive, that can be an option that my children observe me doing on a regular basis? You know, like just less than an hour ago, I had a conversation with my daughter about something going on in her life. And the first thing she told me, she said, mom, she said, last night I prayed through it. And the reason why she says that is not just because I'm just like out here killing it religiously, but because one of the constant pillars of my life is when I encounter an issue and my kids ask me, what do do when you encounter an issue? I pray through it. And so that becomes a skill for her. John-Nelson Pope (52:02) But KC, the other thing is you talked about being a hypocrite and people hypocrisy. You're being authentic. That's genuineness on your part and you're doing that as a modeling and the kids are raised in that milieu, that environment. And so they know that that's an acceptable and loving and caring and thoughtful way of approaching it. I believe in the power of prayer and but But let's just, let's say someone is not ⁓ in terms of practicing ⁓ their faith, but they can also be reflective and intentional. And so the kids will learn how to do that and they can step back and be able to say, okay, I'm going to make, ⁓ I'm going to be reflective and I'm going to be able to make a decision. And I'm going to do it slowly with slow it down. Kasie (52:37) Right. John-Nelson Pope (52:58) and contextualize it as it's said here in segment four. everything you do. Chris (53:04) John, they're watching us. They're watching us. Kasie (53:08) Mm-hmm. Chris (53:08) They're looking at what we're acting on. They're looking at like what we fake. You know, one of the things I would add to this little element here is I love to be honest with my kids and it was throughout like, I'll tell them, like, if I don't know something, I'm going to tell you. I don't really know the answer to this. I'll tell you then what I think and we'll talk about it. And I'll tell you what I think I know also. You know, and they can begin to trust like when I'm speaking on something, I'm not just making it up and flippantly throwing something out there or just flowing an ideal. Like you said, Casey, you know, do as I say, not as I do. I'm saying I have no idea the answer to this. Let's let's figure it out because this is a tough one, you know. John-Nelson Pope (53:49) And you're assuming, and by that you're saying, I think your feedback is important. And even though I'm the parent of the thing is I'm, we're dialogue and we're learning from each other. Chris (53:55) Right. Particularly as we're talking about parenting teens and I don't know Casey. I don't think parenting stops at 25. I ⁓ You know, you're 100 % Kasie (54:08) Yeah. No, I'm still being parented by my mom. Like that's still happening. So, but one thing that I think is really powerful here as we continue on in this discussion is never underestimate the power of an apology with your children. None of us get it right all the time. None of us regulate correctly, authentically and intentionally all the time. There are. John-Nelson Pope (54:29) See you Chris (54:36) especially when the Steelers lose. Kasie (54:38) Exactly. Like nobody is allowed to watch Carolina basketball with me. And it's good reason. And it's for good reason because I literally probably look like I've been possessed by the devil because I just get so angry and so I'm not regulated. Yes, my head turns around and I like vomit pea soup everywhere. So, but the truth is, is that we don't always get it correct. But what we want to do John-Nelson Pope (54:51) Does your head turn around? Ha ⁓ Kasie (55:04) to be restorative and to be reparative in an emotionally regulated relationship is that when we do get it wrong, we are not too proud to say, I'm sorry. John-Nelson Pope (55:15) Okay, kick a question and this is a personal thing on me. Is it all right if I take a minute for that? Because I agree with you. Okay, I was at a church that was impossible. There were only about 20, out of a 650 member church, there were about 20 members that just were hell bent for leather. They did not like me for whatever reasons. They let me know all the reasons why. Chris (55:22) Let's do that and then we'll go to practical questions. Kasie (55:44) you John-Nelson Pope (55:44) And I was thinking, you know, and I got anxious, I got all tied up and knots. And then I thought about, my kids were in high school. How I act and how my wife and I act will show and model for them ⁓ what it means, let's say, be, in our case, Christians, a minister, a ministerial family, do that with dignity and with... ⁓ equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... equine... Kasie (56:31) Mm-hmm. John-Nelson Pope (56:43) that you had to see that or that I acted that way. Yeah, that was real. That was real. Kasie (56:45) Yeah. Chris (56:46) But it's real. Yeah, it's real. You know, I think that we attacked this years ago when we tried to help dads understand that they could cry. You you could shed a tear. You you can say, don't know. ⁓ You know, we can be angry and return to serenity. Casey, you said we can be, you know, honest with, ⁓ my God, what did you say? ⁓ I forgot what you said a little bit ago. John-Nelson Pope (56:55) Yeah Chris (57:15) the genuineness of not being able to have the answer. And apologies, that's right. Yeah. Right. So, yeah, let's move to a new section that we're creating. I tell you, man, I'm resisting, John, I want to do a part three here, but we're going to, we really hit this, I think, pretty well. I think we hit a lot of the things, hopefully to get your brains the changing course a little bit, which is what we do as a therapist with these practical questions. We're thinking about you, the listener, and we're talking to you. John-Nelson Pope (57:29) Okay. Chris (57:42) when we, when we do this, I'm going to take number four and I'm going to say the question that I would like you, you, the listener to the show to think about is what we were talking about with your child's behavior, right? Like, are you reacting to the behavior bait? Right? I got baited when I was a parent to younger kids and they would look at me and they would say, yes, sir. And they would salute me in a sarcastic way. And I mean, would totally get me going. Kasie (58:00) Mmm. John-Nelson Pope (58:10) Mm-hmm. Chris (58:12) So are you reacting to the behavior or are you responding to their emotional state? Are you getting in there with them in the real moment, in the real way, where they're at? Like an adage of social work is that you join the client where they are. So are you able, you the listener, to able to join the emotional state of your child? That's a practical question that we're asking you to think about. We got number five. John, you wanna take it or Casey? Casey goes. John-Nelson Pope (58:44) Casey, where's Kasie (58:45) Yeah, John-Nelson Pope (58:46) number five at? Okay, there you go, got it. Kasie (58:47) yeah, so a practical question on five. Yeah, another question we want to ask you, the listener, is to really kind of get in here and think about this. What emotions does my child see me struggling with the most? Again, this is that whole self-reflection piece. Before we can model, we must master. And I don't mean perfecting. I mean master in terms of when I'm not feeling my best self, what am I doing to help myself in those moments? As we said before, children are gonna see it. They're gonna see how we process and they're gonna see how we move through it. Sometimes what we want to do is we want to focus in on ourselves about how is it that I'm addressing my anxiety, my impatience, my frustration, my anger. Am I constantly doom scrolling on my phone? Am I constantly checking out in my family and playing a game or am I constantly doing the things, the exact things even, that I constantly are concerned about with or talk to my children about? And if the answer to any of those questions is yes, that I'm doing what I'm asking my children not to do, then it is time to take some introspection here and to really reflect on what are my coping mechanisms. And if you're not having them, if you're not finding them, it's okay. It's okay to not know how to do it right now. But try to learn some steps, some techniques. Try to talk to somebody else about it. And if necessary, go and get yourself a therapist. Chris (1:00:25) question is what emotions does my child see me struggling with the most. John, I'm going to say let's jump to number eight ⁓ and do that one instead. John-Nelson Pope (1:00:34) Okay. Okay. ⁓ Seven, eight. ⁓ When my child is overwhelmed, I try to fix the problem or soothe the nervous system first? And that's one of the things that ⁓ we dads end up doing a lot of times is to... is to try to fix the problem. And ⁓ there's a great line from ⁓ RoboCop where one of the people who's getting shot, his partner is shot and she's like, I'm hurt real bad. And he says, as Murphy the cop who has some awareness of himself, the RoboCop, well, they can fix anything. They can always fix it. Well, they can't all the time. in real life, that's fantasy, but in real life, if you try to fix the problem and ⁓ you're cutting them off for their own emotional development, their own maturation as adults or one day to become adults. ⁓ And so say that they have... You want to encourage independence in your children, but the better thing, I think, and I'm not supposed to put values on these things, but it's interdependence that we have. that you can go and rely on wise people, not just your parents, but let's say a trusted teacher or guidance counselor ⁓ or ⁓ a school counselor ⁓ or a clergyman or somebody that is safe, that you can rely on a coach and be able to... rely and get some feedback from them. And so you would seek, learn how to seek wisdom where it is. And so ⁓ that maybe they will be overwhelmed and they're at school and they've been ostracized and bullied at school, that they can find some support there ⁓ and adult help there in that school. I don't know if I'm making sense or not, but... Chris (1:03:00) No, you're making perfect sense. So again, John is asking you the listener right now. He's asking you when your child is overwhelmed, right? You try to just fix the problem Is that what you do or when your child is overwhelmed and whatnot? Do you do you switch and try to soothe the nervous system and self-regulate with them, right? Yeah, good stuff again. This is a this is a new segment that we're doing we're playing around with it to Speak directly to you here towards the end after we presented a lot of information to get you really John-Nelson Pope (1:03:04) Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes, yeah. Chris (1:03:29) to join with us and really be in the moment ⁓ to decide how do we conquer this? What a big topic. like I said, I think that we did a good job trying to get to this big topic in an hour. We'll be revisiting this as we go along 2026, but Neil, we're ready, man. I think that we're ready to go to battle again. I added in the spreadsheet that we got a little tally section. So right now we got Casey with one. John-Nelson Pope (1:03:56) ⁓ no. Neil (1:03:56) No, no, Chris. No, Chris, you can't keep a tally. It's good. No, no, don't mess with my spreadsheet. It will be a surprise at the end of the year. We don't know. It keeps it fair. Don't mess with my sheet. Chris (1:04:00) we can't keep it tally! Ugh. John-Nelson Pope (1:04:08) I'm gonna miss that meeting. So, Chris (1:04:14) I'm sorry Neil, I added something John-Nelson Pope (1:04:14) this is... Chris (1:04:16) I thought was cool, I'm being overrun, I have emotions about it but Casey, ⁓ I'm gonna self-regulate, I'm okay! I thought it was a good idea Neil, but I will divulge, I will let go, it is all your spreadsheet and I apologize publicly for adding an element. Neil (1:04:31) Well, I just want to keep it fair. I don't want to know where the tally is. just want to, every week, I want to be unbiased. I just want to know what's going on because I don't want someone to say, well, you knew that Casey was in the lead and so you started giving it to Chris. you, know, John's, want to keep it unbiased. want to... Chris (1:04:43) Ha ha ha. Kasie (1:04:44) Exactly. John-Nelson Pope (1:04:46) Well, John's not going to be the first. I can't be succinct if my life depended on it. Chris (1:04:53) All right, here we go. We got the shrink wrap up to wrap up our episode today. And this is a friendly, friendly John, it's friendly competition. That's all. Where we kind of give a little review. We give a synopsis of the show and then Neil gets to judge who gets the win for the episode. So I guess Neil, Casey, John needs to recover from all this. We're going to give him a moment to regulate, to settle down. You want to go first or Phil? John-Nelson Pope (1:05:00) huh. Okay. I'm seven years old again, so that's... Chris (1:05:23) Shall I? Kasie (1:05:23) Sure, I can go first. So this is what I really want you to think about as the listener and as someone that I think can really benefit from this information. Every time a child comes to you or your child comes to you or even if it's a child that you care for in some capacity. When they say something out loud or if they have a behavior that is communicative, that something is going on, whether it's from accessing too much information through technology or things like that, the first step is I want you to think about it as if they are directly speaking to you and saying, I don't need you to fix this, I need you to feel this. And I think if you filter through that information in that way, you ultimately will be able to regulate yourself and help regulate with them in an interdependent fashion to help them through the experience. John-Nelson Pope (1:06:19) I'd like to build on that just a little bit, just add to it, because she's built a cathedral with words right there. And I'm just gonna add my little wing, chapel on this, and that is that you approach this with humility and genuineness and authenticity as a parent, and that you have been given the most precious gift possible, and that is your child, your children. And you have, there's all that potential and all that future in them. You don't put your stuff into it. You make it a safe place for them to grow and to grow the way they are supposed to grow and their natural way. And yet you give that presence of yourself to nurture them, to help them in that process. And so, ⁓ You give them that emotional security that Casey talked about. You give them that spiritual security. You give them that sense of your being there that they can rely on you. Even if you're across the globe, they know that their parent is with them in heart, mind, and soul. Chris (1:07:41) Alright, you know, my wrap up listening to this and preparing for this show, part one, part two, it kind of goes along the lines of my faith and hope for us and humanity. I think that we can be very susceptible to fear. And as one president of the United States once proclaimed, we have nothing to fear but fear itself. And I think there's an overwhelm and a learning and I have faith in humanity. really do. Especially our youth. I feel like we need to be genuine and look towards our youth to help us with what is new to us and actually familiar to them so that we can truly figure this thing out together. The human emotional experience in the information age and all the dynasticism that comes with that. We can do this. We don't have to be fearful. I think that we need to be cautious. Kasie (1:08:15) Hmm? Chris (1:08:38) and aware and lead ourselves to prudence, prudent decisions, prudent behavior. And I think that we got to give ourselves some slack because this is all very new, very important. We take it seriously, but it is very doable. And I have great faith in you as a parent. We're doing an episode on parenting. Know that you're enough. Know that you can do this and let's figure it out together. Kasie (1:08:53) Hmm? Mmm. Neil (1:09:11) Man, I love these wrap ups, they're fantastic. I think today's based on what was said from the show, based on what was done, I have to give this one to the Pope. The Pope's, I think, really hit it. I know he expounded on Casey's, but what he brought to the table with that wrap up, I think, is really important for all of us to hear. I think today is the Pope. Kasie (1:09:31) Mm-hmm. Alright! Chris (1:09:35) Love that. John-Nelson Pope (1:09:35) Thank you. Thank you. Chris (1:09:36) Love that, Jonathan. ⁓ Love it, buddy. Yeah, listen, we love doing this show with you. Tell your friends, subscribe, bring somebody apparent along to listen to this one. Cause I think this one and the last one is stuff that people can really practically get. We hope we're doing a good job for you. So stay tuned. We got some things happening in 2026. John Casey survived the storm Casey, John revel in the heat. John-Nelson Pope (1:10:02) Yes, I'm gonna go... Well, I'm sunning in the beach. I'll think of you all. So... You good? You good? Kasie (1:10:03) Yes. I have toilet paper. Toilet Chris (1:10:08) They'll come on over. she's what do you got case up? She's Kasie (1:10:12) paper. Chris (1:10:14) got Plenty of TP. All right, we're gonna be okay Casey. We're coming to your house and we're in desperate need You guys have a great week. Stay safe. Stay well, and we'll see you next time Kasie (1:10:19) you Bye. John-Nelson Pope (1:10:24) Thank you. Bye bye.